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Sure. Pardon the copy and paste reply, but it a perfect opportunity for me to publish up a draft blog post I wrote half a year ago in anticipation of a Brian Krebs post on the topic of Booter sites. The sites claim to offer point and click DDoS services. He understands that CloudFlare is not a hosting provider and that terminating any customer wouldn make the content of the booter sites go away, it would just make them slower and more vulnerable to attack. He also acknowledges that no attack traffic actually originates from CloudFlare network. A few weeks ago Kayne West attorneys contacted CloudFlare insisting that we terminate protection for a customer they said was causing irreparable harm to their client: the parody crypto currency called Coinye. Ken Carter, our legal counsel, explained to Mr. West lawyers that terminating Nike Windrunner Yellow

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exist in so many jurisdictions to prohibit all of these, and why the AUP of every single reputable ISP in existence prohibits them. This isn uncharted territory, this isn something new CloudFlare is just getting into the industry standard (and legal standard) is to prohibit all of these.

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I find it interesting he never responded to this. Any attempt on his part to suggest otherwise can only be interpreted as evidence of guilt. There is no possible arrangement of words which can make it okay.

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Agree, which is why we do take malware and phishing sites, which we can judge as per se harmful, offline. You refer to "sites advertising so called "booter" services." However, with the kind of sites I speak of, "sites providing so called "booter" services" would be a better description. Malware is only good for the operator who benefits from the keylogger, showing ads, or whatever; phishing is only good for the operator who benefits from the stolen information; booters are only good for the booter operator (who profits from selling it) and for the user who paid for it to attack a target. I agree with that standard, and I think you be hard pressed to find a single person who agrees Nike Windrunner Red Navy that any of these three issues are not harmful. So, in your opinion, what makes booters less harmful than malware and phishing sites, which you are willing to take offline?Censorship is a slippery slope, indeed. But I think it is generally accepted that _some_ basic level of what is effectively censorship, is a necessary evil for the health of the Internet. For example, malware and phishing sites, as you mentioned; spam; DDoS attacks. That why laws Nike Long Sleeve Jacket

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Please at least consider making it easier for those of us who are trying to fight malware, botnets, etc, etc to get the original source of the content. I know this will involve some human judgement, and invetiably some mistakes and poor descions but that would still in my view be far prefferable to what we have now. Thanks.

I also like to note that there a semi hidden US bias here what if the target of a botnet, who admin interface is hosted by CF is based in a country where there is no reasonable ability to recourse to the US courts? Iran, for example?It admirable that you do not censor content in response to political pressure, but there IS a difference between protecting freedom of speech and protecting malware, and saying that censoring the malware is a slippery slope is at least partly disingenuous any vaguely controversial decision can be described as a slippery slope to something else.

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58 days ago link

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What makes a site hosting malware per se harmful, and how can you consider malware per se harmful while booters avoid being classified identically? Malware is illegal and obviously a detriment to the internet, as are booter services. But the key question is where do you draw the line. It simple: if you knowingly facilitate an illegal service on your site, your service gets terminated.

a perfect opportunity for me to

stevenh 49 days ago link

the Coinye CloudFlare account wouldn make it go away, it would just make it more vulnerable to attack. They thought that would be terrific. Inherently there is content on our network that I find distasteful or even harmful. In the past, we been called to task by other journalists [http: for allowing controversial websites to use our network. Amazon, for instance, terminated Wikileak account after political pressure [http: More recently an article circulated that they were censoring books where people fantasized about having sex with dinosaurs [http: Other CDN providers are notorious for taking content offline at the first hint of pressure. We don do that, even when the pressure comes from someone we truly respect like Brian. Fundamentally, we won play the role of the Internet morality cops. But the key question is where do you draw the line. While we believe deeply in principles of due process and will push back against what we deem abusive legal requests [http: ultimately if ordered by a court through valid legal process we will comply. He left the Washington Post and started Krebs On Security around the same time as we were launching CloudFlare. I actually tried to hire him back then. Thankfully he didn accept the offer because he has become one of the leading security journalists writing anywhere today. I think the discussion is hard, but it is healthy and important. To that end, if there are any large security or technology conferences that would like to host such a debate between me and Brian on stage, just let me know when and where and I in. what? what IS the counter to a sufficiently large botnet? ultimately we all have a limit at which point we can receive no more traffic. No one in their right mind would today sit down and design something like BGP, for example. With that in mind, any large provider (or large consumer with capability to cause harm) has the responsibility to be a good citizen of the internet, and not to (by action or inaction) advance the agendas of those who would see its demise. As much as it might be convenient from an operational POV, and justifiable from a moral POV, washing your hands of responsibility and saying "It not up to us, it up to the courts" just doesn work when the infrastrucure we all building on is so very fragile.

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